As a former manager, I was told my reviews should never be sufficient enough for an employee to qualify for a bonus or a raise. I was getting ready to quit and had 6 reviews to complete. Knowing that once I gave my two weeks' notice, I would be let go. So, I did all the reviews 3 days before I handed in my notice. Each employee had their copy, and the originals were sent by truck mail to HR. Going from our terminal to the terminal where HR was took 3 days. All 6 got their raise and a quarterly bonus.

I have overheard my own manager being told that the highest review she can give any of her staff is 'meets expectations' because going beyond that would mean paying us more and they don't want to do that.

A good question to ask in the interview is: Over the last 5 years what percentage of available bonuses have been paid out? I've asked that and been met with silence before. I followed it up by asking if they couldn't tell me that (both interviewers had +5 years at the company) did anyone get a bonus at all last year? More silence. I didn't end up taking that job.

My opinion is: Get Bent. There is nothing in that offer to attract anyone except the desperate, foolish, naive, or ruthless. My wage is something i rely on, and Im not leaving a significant portion of my yearly income up to some middle man or a team of disconnected fools pushing inaginary goals they know can never be reached.

How to say you will never receive a penny of the bonus. Corporate wants Employees to be smart in the jobs. But, when Corporate attempts to take advantage of these same Employees, Corporate is surprised they are not ignorant.

So, management can set unreasonable or outright unattainable goals, and managers can waffle about on vague KPIs or biased opinions, and yet that'd be "lucrative bonus" which justifies working absurdly hard. I'd sooner call buying a lottery ticket a lucrative business opportunity. lol

I worked for a company that had something similar to this. But there was a set number of things that had to be achieved in 1 year to get paid out on the bonus. I agreed to that and was confident that I could hit those. At 6 months into the job I hit all the metrics set to be paid out the bonus. I mentioned that to my boss/the company owner as when the bonus would be paid wasnt discussed (at the time of the metrics being hit or end of year?). He told me "we wont be paying you the bonus because the rest of the company employees are far behind and not doing well". He changed what he had told me and added in "at owners digression". I started looking for a new job right away because if you are going to lie to me and not pay what we agreed on an now base it on things outside of my control I dont want to be there. It was a learning experience for me and about a $20k education I didnt want LOL.

I once worked for a company that based their bonuses and raises ENTIRELY off an end of year review with your direct manager. There were no specific metrics to be met, it was just based off his opinions and expectations of your performance. He stated that he expected ALL of us to "exceed expectations" so by going above and beyond and exceeding, we met his expectations, and therefore only ranked a 3 (met expectations) instead of a 4 (exceeded expectations). In addition, HIS bonus ONLY applied if none of his direct reports qualified for a bonus or a raise, so there was absolutely ZERO incentive to be fair to us.

Yup! Never take a job (or anything else) based on what someone might give you in the future.

Wow, the manager part guarantees conflict of interest between employee and company. Not to mention inappropriate control over employees by managers, all the way to being able to demand favors of those who are dependent on the bonus money. This kind of thing is abusive behavior + lawsuits waiting to happen. Somebody buy those executives season passes on the clue train.

Thank god the bonuses in my workplace are set in a collective agreement. United we stand, divided we fall.

Pretend the bonus doesn't exist. If the guaranteed base salary is "enough" for you, YES. If not, then NO.

Yep, the game is rigged from the start. The scoring system is made up & the points don't matter. Heads - they win. Tails - you lose.

As someone in policy and assessment, the lack of clear metrics/rubrics is very unpalatable. If there's any sort of bonus to be paid out, it's best to link it to profit/revenue sharing and to apply it evenly.

And this is why I continue to tell all my peers to never count on the bonus payout year after year. Yet every year one or two (or more) of my teammates will complain about how the metrics, the company modifiers, and other factors are screwing them out of the expected bonus they were counting on. For me it's just essentially a second tax return (we get ours during tax season). I don't count on it to make ends meet but it's a nice extra that helps. But if it's not my base salary it's not part of my budget.

Todafreakinglooo to that bonus program.

Always gain a base salary that you can accept without reliance on the bonus element. Ensure that bonuses are paid for your own work (or your contribution to the team.) Anything else is fancy tosh to attract the 'less well educated.' Always review the employee benefits, medical, life assurance, saving/share plans, tax efficient salary sacrifice schemes for electric cars etc

Such corporate behaviour is actually illegal here in Germany. But funny enough, when I transitioned from school to jobs, a similar one was actually my first job. It was a scummy company, already paying criminally low (I had no idea, I was green) And a significant part of the small salary was declared as general bonus, that only got paid when everything was good - month after month. It was such a dirty company, that not only was the turnover ridiculous (you'd be senior after 5 months), but people generally leaving with incredible hate for the owner and designing plans to damage him - including me. Today, having never forgotten about that company, I don't think it was every somebody about the owner being a "bad guy". He was so f***ed up, that I am convinced, he's not simply an asshole. I am convinced, he's having psychological anomalies. These days, my experiences back then are almost too ridiculous for myself to believe, that it actually happened.

Always get an exact amount in writing. A bird in the hand.

Yes IF I can see historical bonuses from comparable roles here

That bonus plan is a big bucket of "NOPE"! You'd never see a penny of it, even if you worked your backside off. Time to look for another job.

Bonuses that are not based on something you have direct impact on, in a measurable way, is just another way for the company to dangle a carrot on a stick.

At a hospital 2 decades back, we were told that "exceeding expectations is now part of your job descriptions. So, merit bonuses and raises are now no longer possible." Within a year, the entire department staff had 'relocated' completely out of the system.

When I was hired, one aspect of compensation that was emphasized was a guaranteed bonus. Fast forward two years and guess what got converted to "based on leadership metrics"?

While searching for a job, I always asked what I can expect for base pay. I don’t care about bonuses or incentives, I expect to be paid for the hours I work.

my one comment is that I used to assume that folks in leadership were competent. Er...no... not always and quite often completely the reverse, very rare to find fairness and awareness of equality and clarity of core organisation effectiveness measures. PS I am an old guy now your channel gives me great insights into the world of work today so thankyou very much!

"Are you ready to sign?" "Yup, signing my resignation right now"

That's not a bonus plan. That's a brass ring.

My response would be : "no thanks; I don't work for free". That type of "lucrative bonus" if just a way of say do more work and work more hours for what your already getting paid; except if you stay on your managers and the managers boss's good side". It feels like it is setting the stage for abuse of power in my opinion.

That's a hard "No". Any kind of "bonus" paid though the whims of a manages is no actual payment. Salary or nothing.

No as it's just a way to enable Managers to foist unrealistic targets and work loads on you with the threat of not reaching bonus targets that can be a moving target at a manager's whim. If you erre at a company that allows those tactics it would be time to assess the job market Love your content Loe 🤗

They want employees to play a rigged carnival game. You don't know if you're winning until the game is over. Find a more transparent company.

I left a position with an equally absurd performance rating system my manager certainly made sure that everyone under him was adequate, but if he gave out too much money to the rest of us, his bonus would have been affected. Note that I said I left that position.

Easiest way to give someone a bonus and them not seeing a penny of it, the opinion is 99% of the time gonna be "Not good enough", just to save the company money.

The effective financial value of this compensation package is zero, when are you signing?

Any compensation not guaranteed should not actually be considered part of the compensation package. If the role pays well without the bonus then it's adequately compensated and the bonus is truly a bonus. But if adequate compensation relies on the bonus, it's definitely not worth it, and they're setting up a system that allows them to string employees along in a potentially very toxic work environment. Personally, I think bonuses are themselves problematic, regardless of industry. This includes tips. Jobs should pay fairly and not rely on or require bonuses/tips/etc., which are almost always unreliable and subjective.

Yeah, that compensation package certainly seems as though it might be at least tangentially related to the production of bovine seminal breeding stock alimentary waste products.

I second that! My work started doing the same thing and even though I have a great relationship with my manager it was still obvious that the likely hood of me ever seeing more than 50% of that bounus was very very low.

I knew a fellow who got a big bonus and even a company car, but of course neither were considered as annual compensation upon which his pension was built.

Such bonuses tend not to materialize, or you will get just enough to bring your total compensation to "low-average."

That's up there with the lowered salary that comes with stock options. If you can't deal with the base salary, don't take the job.

I relate so heavily with this one.

we were offered "deals" like this several times trough my career.. nobody ever fell for it..

That is like going down the ladder and accepting a job based on commission only! Deplorable proposal!

Nope. Too many red flags...

TALK ABOUT AN OFFER YOU SHOULD REFUSE!!!!

exemplary challenge to subjectivism, thank you!

I once worked for a company where raises were given as a percentage. But when promoted to supervisor I learned only one person per department could have the full raise, all others could get 1-2%. I tried to fight for my 15 other staff but lost. When I was moved to another department, I was given a less than stellar review for the first time in 15 years. When asked why, I was told, "you know the drill as a former supervisor..." I wrote out how it was poor management and ridiculous to treat loyal employees like this. I was happy to get laid off a few months later.

"And I ra-a-aaan, I ran so far awa-a-aaaay"....

I’m so excited I found this page. I was researching it on another page and someone shared your name!!! You are very helpful. ❤Thanks💖

I used to tell my daughter "Ill think about it." When she was younger to try and curb her wanting everything she saw. I worked pretty good. Sometimes, it basically just meant 'no' however. LOL

Welcome to my company, where the bonus depends from the sales target set by CEO. And the sales target is 20% bigger each year...

At a former employer they came up with a bonus system to reduce waste. When the numbers were released we had missed the target by a few hundredths of a percent. The managers told us we almost made it and to try a little harder. This went on for another 4 months with the same story. The next month we had had enough and waste skyrocketed. We not only missed the target we also wasted everything that had been saved the previous months plus about 5% more. They paid the bonus that month and discontinued the program.

Every large company I have ever worked for uses this evil tactic. Its funny how when you call them out on it they threaten to terminate because you aren't meeting goals. However they get real quiet when they find out you retained an attorney because things are getting out of hand. Once again I have never regretted my decision to go self employed.

I'd pass on that because they will definitely find reasons why you didn't qualify for the bonus, you'll never get it.

I am self employed however your videos induce massive anxiety from my days having a boss. Legit heart palpitations and panic sets in from your videos

I am ready to sign... to sign OFF.

I worked at a place that didn't give raises for 6 years. It was a government job. Then when they gave raises they said they were going to give the people who hadn't gotten them for 6 years double what new people got regardless of job reviews.

I once had a manager say no to turning in things that were broken because “that affects my bonus” so we all lost what little respect we had for him after that

Yeaaaah... no. I wouldn't be signing this. My experience is that companies who like to dangle carrots in front of their employee's eyes also have other little manipulative tactics to keep you on your toes, a bad culture when it comes to mistakes and are in general a very bad work environment. Not a place where I'd want to spend a huge portion of my time

I worked at a call center where the main bonus was paid based on calls taken per working hour. That meant any time spent on breaks, team meetings, or even just waiting for a call to come in would count. The objective was 3.5 calls an hour and we sometimes spent a whole hour in the "available" status. And all leadership has to say about it is that we'd get there if our after-call work (about 5 minutes) was faster. Leadership is absolutely disconnected from the reality of our work, and it shows in their metrics.

You want my thoughts on it? Run away, girl, run away!

"Are you ready to sign?" .... NO

I once worked for a Big 4 consulting firm. We called this kind of comp bonus a ‘not gonna get it’ bonus. When we had achieved our numbers that should have paid out the bonus the senior partners just increased the numbers. Often the last 2 weeks of the performance year. Never once got the bonus.

What kind of HR foolishness?!?!😂

Ah, I never thought about asking how a bonus is structured. Thank you

Where I worked we had formal performance plans. The idea was that, for each critical element in the plan, If you met the objectives in the plan you get a "meets" rating (3 out of 5) If you substantially exceeded the elements you got a 5 rating and if you didn't meet the objectives you got a 1. Your overall rating was the average of the ratings for each element. a 3 rating means they you did exactly what was expected . There were typically performance awards for getting a 4 or 5 rating, which I think amounted to a small percentage of your salary. If you got a 1 or a 2 rating it triggered a performance improvement plan and could lead to your demotion or separation if the low ratings continued. The ratings were still dependent upon the opinion of the manager but with actual performance objectives it was harder to have really gross abuses of the ratings. The extreme ratings (1 and 5) were hard to get - to get a 5 all of your critical elements had to be rated a 5, and to get a 1 everything had to be rated a 1.

The trouble with putting unpredictable bonuses in the contract is that employees only get burnt by this scam once.

Yup. I'll never fall for that again. I fell for it once when I was 19, and once when I was 23. I will never be able to look a hiring manager in the eye without a snarl on my face if they bring up bonuses which rely on subjective and undefined goals again.

I had an emotionally unstable boss so if I was offered that by management at the company it'd be a big no from me.

That's a hard "No thank you"

Proper response? Toodaloo is good. "I was born at night, but not last night," is better. Basically, your bonus is based on metrics and evaluations that can be manipulated at any time to prevent a worker from reaching their goals. Nothing like being able to move the goal posts any time management wants. Perhaps you should ask your work bestie a professional way of saying, "Hey, yeah, I got your bonus right here."

Yeah Bonus should be just that a bonus not part of the compensation

Bonuses like that are like playing an old pinball machine. Only the top levels of directors receive anything substantial.

You really do have a fantastic variety of characters here, and really talented voice options to go with each specific character... Actually you are a very talented Actress. Love your work here, but would also like seeing you in a movie one day soon.

Corporate bonus lure/trap. Makes you work more and harder for no pay.

The old dangling carrot 🥕- employee rarely comes out on top.

And the manager who decides if you qualify for the bonus gets a bonus for not giving you any bonus 😂😂😂

"I'll think about it, Toodaloo" And they never saw her again

You can never do enough for a good boss. If your boss deems him or herself to be "good", you can rest assured that they will tell you that you are not doing enough. A "boss" is there to lead, guide and inspire. Not look down on and ridicule others.

In a former job, with a shit hourly wage, I was told that the generous bonus and stock options were part of what made the total package so generous and competitive. 2 months in, we were told that our entire group was going to be shut down in 9 months. No bonus since I'd only been around a couple months and half my stocks were set to vest a week after closure. I don't look for jobs anymore that base a third of my compensation on hopes and fluff

This is the way it works at every company I'm familiar with (although the "personal goals" may or may not be more defined). At one of my jobs, hitting the bonus would be like winning the lottery, both in terms of the percentage of salary, but also the likelihood of hitting it (they seemed to think a large bonus would allow unrealistic deadlines to happen). At another job the bonus was usually at least mostly paid out, although the criteria wasn't any better than this.

Love the vids ....!

Know your company and managers. In some situations this is an amazing opportunity, in others it’s more for less

I was a manager and filled out employee performance evaluations to be used for determining raises. Every one of them was sent back to me to redo because they were too high. I was told the scores were based on expectations and I apparently didn’t set high enough expectations. I quit soon after.

Goodhart's Law! Sometimes if you know the metrics, you end up incentivised to hit the metrics rather than increase overall value/ returns.

Bonuses, like tips, are not reliable. If the pre-bonus is not sufficient then the contract is not worth it. Especially if the targets for said bonuses are not laid out clearly in advance.

I hade similar situation, in the cleaning service of all places... Just said no, and walked out. Still doing the same job I did before.

Immediately no

A bonus is just that, a bonus. If that is what a company is trying to use to lure in talent, they are doing it wrong.

The only company goal that effects our bonus in any tangible way is revenue, and our personal performance goes through a review process so it's not just the manager's say

I hate that you are so accurate in every vid. And this is the most critical.

If I got options. "Yeah, I'm not going to pick you," If I need work. "I'll use you to be my stepping stone." Obviously, not saying that to the company, but that's my thoughts.

As a General Manager, I split my target bonuses with the employees, since they were a large part of the reason WE were consistently exceding the targets.

Run...Run, Forrest, RUN!!

A colleague of mine was late every single day (she tried negotiating her work hours to start half an hour later and they refused so she came late anyway 😂) when told it’ll affect her bonus she flat out said she doesn’t care and still she got a better bonus than I half the team for some incomprehensible reason. so yeah bonuses with unknown criteria don’t pay bills.

Bonuses as incentive is fine for people fairly high up the corporate ladder. I'd never agree to that kind of deal as an easily replaceable employee. Chances are too big, they're going to f you over. I want a guaranteed salary, that's appropriate for the workhours and type of work I do.

"Are you ready to sign?" No, thank, I'm fine...

I’ve never had an issue with my manager deciding how I do.

That isn't even going into the potential of sexism, racist, or biased attitudes of your manager that may also effect your pay.